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02:00:27 0 |
MURRAY LERNER INTRVIEWS GREG LAKE. INSIDE OF A RECORDING STUDIO. SEVERAL GUITARS ON STANDS BEHIND HIM. COMPUTERIZED SOUND BOARD TO HIS RIGHT.
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02:00:28 0.34 |
CU OF LAKE'S GUITAR. OFF CAMERA LERNER GIVES FILMING DIRECTION:
Greg Lake 0:00 That was nothing to do with the album. Murray Lerner 0:03 start over again about that. Yeah. I try to formulate my question when you answer your question. So the audience knows, right? Greg Lake 0:11 Yeah. Murray Lerner 0:12 You said, What about album covers and Greg Lake 0:15 album cover artists is an interesting subject. because invariably, the covers come after the, the album. And quite often, they're really nothing to do with the record itself. But it's, it's, that's, that's a wonderful thing about art. It's like water or mercury, it very easily flows in amalgamates, you know, an album cover can become the music simply by interpretation. You know, and that is the case, certainly with the brain salad surgery album cover. And to some extent, with the King Crimson cover, which was, I believe, already done before we'd made the record, it just happened to to be there, you know, but when you look at it, it's, you know, you would swear that it had been done just for that reason. And that's one of the things about art, I think, it does have beneath almost all art, there is an interconnecting fiber, I think, somewhere. And I think that, you know, that's why how I feel about songwriting is that music, in some sense, flows through you, it is not something that you invent in that way. It's already out there, you know, this energy is flowing through artists, and it flows through all art. It's really just emotional expression. And it's very easy, in some senses, to hook one thing to another. In the case of ELP, and classical music, before we did something like Pictures at an Exhibition, you know, it was hard to imagine how a rock band really could do a symphony. But you can, you know, it just it works. Because it's music. It's only music. Murray Lerner 2:05 Interesting, but just one thing I wanted to go to that I forgot about before electricity and music, which was a fairly new thing did you use when you started? Was there electric music? Or what did you feel about electricity as as an addition or electric music? Greg Lake 2:24 I think the what electricity did in terms of music, I mean, first, of course with the electric guitar. But secondly, with synthesizers, and more lately, with samplers, it's brought a new expression into music. A synthesizer has got sounds which are in some way symphonic. But in others totally new and original. And it's brought a new I believe the correct word is tongra. to music. In other words, all sounds previous was symphonic or natural, you know, jazz blown instruments, hit instruments, plucked instruments, they were all natural, organic sounds. But since the advent of electrically driven instruments, there's been a whole new coloration in music, which I think is, is a good thing. It's brought around a whole new way of expressing. Murray Lerner 3:25 What about an electric guitar, though? How did you like the idea of electricity being added to a guitar? Greg Lake 3:31 I think it's a wonderful thing. I mean, it was just as I say, it's become I mean, through people like Jimi Hendrix again, the Isle of Wight, it's become a whole new form of expression. Whole new genres of music have come about because of the electric guitar wouldn't have happened on an acoustic guitar. And a lot of the music of the late 20th century would not have happened, had it not have been for electrical innovations. We ourselves pioneered the Moke synthesizer. That was a, you know, another dimension in music. Murray Lerner 4:12 What was that? I mean, how would you specify that dimension in terms of new personally with a guitar, you play both acoustic and electric? What is the difference? Greg Lake 4:22 It's, well, it's a number of things. It's, you know, technically it is. It goes beyond the spectrum harmonically of acoustic instruments in in a technical sense, in the sense, though, of power, one can generate such power as to literally shake someone's body physically. And so it's a whole different energy, a way of transferring energy, and it's very exciting thing you only have to listen to a great guitar player. As like Jimmy that, you know, it's just thrilling to hear. I mean, I went out once watched Jimi Hendrix. And he dropped the guitar threw it on the ground and it sounded better than most people playing it. You know? Why? I don't know, it just, you know, it worked for him, you know. And feedback became an element in electric guitar playing feedback was used, distortion was used things that that the original creators tried to get rid of, were the actual things that people used to actually create the music with fascinating, really, almost in defiance of, of the technical correctness. Murray Lerner 5:46 But you were for you. You took to that? Greg Lake 5:50 I did. Yeah, it was, it was just that when I think most young people did, it was exciting. It was the excitement and the revolution, it was part of a revolution. breaking down the barriers and an expression really of defiance as a teenager, I think that's how, certainly in the 50s and the 60s, electronic instruments represented the the weapon of destruction, you know, you would hold an electric guitar, and you had the expression of revolution in your hands. Murray Lerner 6:28 Very well put. What about the Moog synthesizer? How did that obviously that became part of your Greg Lake 6:35 it did did the Moog synthesizer was really brought to the forefront in a song I wrote called Lucky man. And it was a lucky man was an afterthought on on the first DLP album, we'd been in the studio for a month or six weeks, and we'd finished the album, we recorded all the material we had, and we were still one song short. So I came up with this track, Lucky man, it's something I wrote when I was actually when I was 12 years old. And it was a it was a sort of folk song. And I don't think, you know, Keith didn't really feel as though he couldn't really find a way to play it. You know, it was just, he wasn't used to play in folk songs. And they weren't really keyboard orientated. So anyway, I made the record more or less on my own, you know, just piled on the guitars, bass, multi voices I'd put on it. And in the end, it sounded pretty good. And I think at that point, Keith felt, you know, it put try and put a part on it. And that was when we tried the Moog synthesizer at the end. And of course, that solo became world famous, and to this day is a landmark really in electronic music. Murray Lerner 7:53 So you felt good about what the Moog synthesizer could do? Yes. And again, describe what it was unique effect that it wasn't really stuff that was heard before. Greg Lake 8:03 I think it was about the boss view. There was an effect on it called port mentor, where it slides through notes, boom, you go right through. And of course, and when you play this effect, with lines, arpeggios, and lines, it creates a whole new way of playing, which really, I mean, you can get a sort of glissando, orchestral effect, but it's not the same. This The Moog synthesizer did bring in a new element of sound, and, and, and a way to play music. That's very important. And originally, of course, it was monophonic only you could only play one note at a time. But very quickly, it became polyphonic and then you could play bunches of them. And then on and on, you know, it's never stopped developing. Murray Lerner 8:55 And you then start to write things that took advantage. Greg Lake 8:58 Yeah, we definitely did. We definitely did. And we kind of we made trilogy, which was the I think, a second DLP album. And we use so many synth overdubs, that we had a real problem playing it live. So we kind of we thought about it on the next album, and made sure that we could actually play the things live that we had recorded, we had to sort of rein it in a bit. Because you're tempted, no, it was like a kid with a new toy. We had this this new freedom and this new ability to layer on a multitrack recording was the other thing that was interesting. The ability to multitrack and low layer, put layer upon layer of of synths on and we did a lot of that problem was of course we come to play the show. You couldn't do that and so we were restricted after the Trilogy record. So we figured out that we needed to be able to play the things live. Murray Lerner 10:05 You couldn't pre record some of the stuff. Greg Lake 10:10 We did try in the Yeah. |
02:10:55 627.27 |
NEW TAKE OF INTERVIEW:
Greg Lake 10:26 No, we're going back to the story of trilogy, we, we had a piece on there, I think it was called a balanced Bolero. And we piled up these scents. And we attempted to try and play it using a tape to play some of the extra synth parts. And I'll never forget one night, we tried to do it. And the monitors went off, and we lost. So we were playing out of time with obey was a nightmare. So we never did that again. But of course, now of course, people run stuff off sequences and computers. I'm not sure how I feel about that. I mean, I think I think live music is about live music. I'm not really too keen on, on, you know, half of it being pre recorded in a way this. It's, it's tempting. But I think really, it's not what what an audience wants, they come to see someone perform. Greg Lake 10:26 Right on the Isle of Wight. There was a Moog synthesizer, I believe Greg Lake 11:33 Yeah, Yeah, we used it there. That was really the early days of it used to go out of tune. I mean, it was a difficult thing to use in the early in the early days. But they improved it. And and we continued to use it, how I think it was one of the things really that, you know, was another element of ELP, which was a breakthrough. It just struck people, because they hadn't really heard anything quite like that. He was also a tremendous help with a three piece band. It was it was something else in our armory that we could pull out. That would be a strength. And so from that point of view, it was it was very useful. Murray Lerner 12:19 Does electricity do more than just shake people up? Does it do anything musically? Or does it Greg Lake 12:27 Yeah, I think Murray Lerner 12:28 spiritually, Greg Lake 12:29 spiritually, I think it does, because anything that gives you a new, opens up new possibilities musically, gives you a new way to express. And some of the some of the synth things that we did were, for instance, extremely beautiful things. They weren't just used to hit hard and to shake people physically, but they were used in a more gentle way. And so yeah, I think I think that the advent of electricity, coming into music was a good thing. But like all good things, it could become abused, and it could become misused. And and, and so be it. I mean, you know, I suppose one could argue that about the invention of the piano, you might go back and ask Mark, you know, do you think it's a good thing? And he might say no, you know, you've just ruined it all. But in truth, I think that, you know, used with integrity and used with honesty, I think electronics brought something creative and good to music. Murray Lerner 13:40 What is music? Greg Lake 13:43 Music is really the expression, I think of emotion and the transference of that emotion from one person to another. Without necessarily the use of words. I mean, as simple as drums in a jungle, it transfers a feeling or a meaning with sound through the air. I think in its simplest form, that's what music is. And the refinement of it and the refinement of the skills it takes to use that ability is the sophistication of music. Murray Lerner 14:28 Why does it affect everyone universally in different ways? Greg Lake 14:32 Because I think we are electronic receptors in a way we are we have the ability to interpret sound emotionally. And I think it probably comes from things like the beating of the heart, the voice of a mother. The simple things like you don't like someone shouting, but you like someone saying I love you, you know? It's it's just a natural thing for you. able to hear sound and associated with feeling. And I think so it is with music. Certain harmonic relationships have certain effects, you know, a minor chord as a sad overtone, but a major chord has a happy tone. So, you know, I think in that sense, people are having an inbuilt receptor and interpreter of sound. And music really is just creating those sounds. Murray Lerner 15:34 Just to get back, we'll finish up with the Isle of Wight, when you realized that you were superstars in a way, by virtue of the reaction. What happened after the Isle of Wight? Greg Lake 15:46 It's hard to remember. Every day was extraordinary. It was, it seems now when I look back, like an entire blur, it's not until someone like yourself brings up a specific date, you know that I can start to relate to it. It was just a blur day upon day upon day of extraordinary events. The Olympic Stadium, Montreal, California jam, Isle of wight. there were just things that went one after the other, and ELP would play probably, I don't know, 200 shows a year. So every everyday different city and it just became a blur. Good blur, a really good blur. I mean, I've cut you know, you can't go through something like that with people being so appreciative, and so responsive and enthusiastic. It was a fantastic period. And, you know, I'm eternally grateful for being lucky enough to be in that position. Because I believe in some senses, it was just fate, you know, really don't look upon myself as being talented. I just think I was lucky to want to play originally to have the one to play music and and just was was was lucky along the way in a way. |
02:17:50 1042.47 |
NEW TAKE OF INTERVIEW:
Murray Lerner 17:16 What about the money? Part of it was that as interest rates, what is it squeezed? Murray Lerner 17:23 What about the money was that of any into money. Greg Lake 17:25 I always looked upon the money as being a sort of byproduct of the success. It certainly Murray Lerner 17:36 We have to start there - I always looked upon the money. go ahead Greg Lake 17:41 I always looked upon the money as being a byproduct of the success. It was never the motivation for playing music. Because when I started to play music, I had no concept of being famous, or I never thought I'd be in a band that would have you know, doesn't it's hit records or anything like that. I played music because I loved it. And because it was exciting. And the money and everything like that came later. And of course, it's nice to be you know, when you have success, and the checks start rolling in. And it's a wonderful thing. But it isn't why you do it. I don't think it's 99. Well, maybe even more, I just don't think musicians are motivated. Generally by money. It's just something that comes along and how you use it, how much it means to you, is different for each person. But I don't think for most musicians, it was a, an essential motivating factor. Because you just when you start, you just do not have the concept that you're going to be rich and famous one day, you start because you love music. Murray Lerner 18:50 Why do you love playing to a group to an audience also. You don't play to yourself Greg Lake 18:56 yeah, well, I do play for myself. But but it is lovely to play for people. Never since I was a tiny kid. I used to play at parties, you know, and stuff like that. And of course, you know, to be appreciated. Is is fantastic. Especially as a young person, you know, you feel when you're young, you're looking for recognition, you're looking for a path in life. And when people start to appreciate what you do, it's like a guiding hand. You feel this warm wind following you and and it's an assurance. I think a lot of young people today don't have that assurance. They just don't know what to do. They want to do something. They just don't know what it is. And I think that's why I say I don't consider myself as much talented as I consider myself fortunate to have known what it was I wanted to do. It just was and of course by the time I was sort of 14 everybody would say oh isn't he talented. Did you know that it wasn't talent, it was just that I played the guitar when I was young. And so it looked pretty clever, you know? And it followed all followed on from there, really. Murray Lerner 20:11 But just getting back to the other way, I, I can't really imagine what it would be like to suddenly be known that such a super event. I might, I mean, most of the other artists were really already pretty famous. Greg Lake 20:26 Yes, that's right Murray Lerner 20:28 it must have blown your mind. Greg Lake 20:29 They will Yeah, it was a mind blowing moment. It was, you know, the Isle of Wight was history in and of itself. I mean, even if ELP had not played there, it would have still been a massive historical event. A landmark really in rock and roll history, but doubly so for me. And for the rest of the boys in ELP, because it was, you know, it was an overnight success. It was just, it was the corny phrase, a star overnight, that's exactly what it was. And all I can tell you is it is a stunning thing to happen to anyone. And, and a wonderful thing in a way. That was a wonderful joyful thing, to be able to reach out all across the globe. From one performance. It's, it's hard to describe, the next morning, you go and open the door. And the milkman has changed, you know, he wants to talk to you in a you know, everyone wants to talk to you. And it is for a while, it's a fabulous thing. But after a while, you develop almost an immunity to it, it becomes normal, and you live your life as anyone else would, you know, and in a way, I've got this theory about fame, that that, you know, it is in a way, I think, what people think you are rather than what you are, you know, so I never get too carried away with with fame or recognition in that sense, because I always think, well, nobody really knows me. I mean, they only know what they see up there. And, you know, fame and success can go as quickly as it came. And so when I I've always been pretty realistic about that really. Murray Lerner 22:27 Okay. |
02:22:56 1349.08 |
SOMEONE BLOWS THEIR NOSE LOUDLY OFF CAMERA. INTERVIEW CONTINUES:
Murray Lerner 22:37 I was gonna ask you about reading I went, we came across, because of my mouth. devasthanams interest? Were there any critics who really blasted you? Yeah. Wow. Yeah. How did you feel about critics who said vile things about you? repeat my question. Greg Lake 22:55 We, you know, from the very beginning, the Isle of Wight, I think it was a bit as if, you know, because we'd come from these well known bands that we were like the son of a rich and famous father. And, you know, in a sense, we'd had it too easy. Not true. I, because I'd spent and we all spent an event years and years, starving, living in the back of vans, and the all the rest of it, but, and we had paid our dues, God only knows. But that was the perception is that one day ELP formed the next day, it was famous across the world. And there were journalists who, you know, didn't like that. I remember once the late John Peel saying that we were a waste of talent and electricity. And at the time, it annoyed me, you know, because I, I knew what we put into it. I knew the care and the, and the feeling and everything that we invested in it. And you know, you don't like people to say bad things. Now I look back on it. And I think, yeah, you know what, I can see what you were saying. And it was some truth in it. And ELP was a bit pretentious. And but, you know, it's a mixed bag of things, you know, that you don't, you don't do extraordinary things by being ordinary you don't do you don't break down barriers unless you do some damage. You know, and I think in that sense, we got up a few people's noses. But genuinely, I always felt that the public the people loved the band. They knew what we were, they could sense what we were the journalists, I think we're obligated to write something about it. And of course, after a while after the honeymoon finished, then comes you know, it's almost obligatory to have a go in and ELP was was the target of a lot of that journalistic bandwagon jumping thing where we actually used to read criticisms of the band where we knew the guy hadn't been to the concert. And he wrote a review of the show, but he hadn't been there, because he got the order of the songs, you know, it included songs that we never played or so it almost became fashionable to knock ELP. And I suppose in a way, one has to feel a bit honored. When people take the trouble to go out of their way to be nasty, it means you've affected someone, somewhere, somehow Murray Lerner 25:39 Does it depress you. Greg Lake 25:40 I can honestly say it didn't. And the reason it didn't, is because when we went out and performed, people loved us, you know, and, and it was still to this day, and extremely warm feeling towards the band, from the people themselves. And Anna, I have to say a lot of journalists were very supportive, you know. So that was it, I you know, but nobody likes to read bad, you know, bad things about you. It's not an it's not a pleasant experience. But I certainly didn't lose any sleep over it. Murray Lerner 26:15 Because there was some really, I can't remember the name of the guy, some guy who was negative about you was the critic was about miles. Greg Lake 26:26 Well, the one famous one was John Peel, a waste of talent, electricity. And there were all kinds of things that used to come up with these fabulous lies. Too much pomp and not enough circumstance was another one. And, you know, it's fair enough. It's fair, you know, miles got criticized a lot. And I think, you know, another guy who really broke down barriers of understanding and was prepared to suffer and was prepared to get the knocks. And I think if you're not, then you better be playing easy listening music, that no one really can knock, you know, but it's not going to change anything, it's not going to, it's not going to be for want of a better word progressive. I like music, which is great. I like to hear music, which opens new doors up. Otherwise, we'd all be listening to the same music we always listened to in 1950, you know, it would never change. Murray Lerner 27:25 Obviously, you also felt you were creatively changing the face of music. Greg Lake 27:30 We we con... We were conscious of wanting to do that. Yeah. A more. So perhaps King crimson was a band that really set out to not be the same is in those days, it the it was good to be original. Now, it's good to be the same. I mean, if you go along to a record company today is oh, I've got this new group, they'll say Who do they sound like? And if you say, well, they don't sound like anybody. So we don't want them. You know, they they want somebody who sounds like somebody that's already successful. In those days, it was important to be original. Any one of the artists at the Isle of Wight, you could play five seconds of their record, and you would know who that was. Immediately. You know, nowadays, I listen to a record, I could listen to an entire CD and couldn't tell you who it was. Yeah, so identity, the music of that time had identity and originality, and, and sincerity. And there was it was much more purposeful, you know, and I think it had a lot more integrity. Murray Lerner 28:40 So you felt that the silver outfit the knives in the pan and organ. and all of That was integrity. Greg Lake 28:52 In its day, I think it was in his day. I think he was, you know, one mustn't forget that. It. It is showbusiness it is entertainment. You know, and I think to that extent, nothing wrong with that. Really, I mean, some artists are more or more geared to that some less, you know, Elvis was a great entertainer. Didn't make him less of a great singer than, you know, the Beatles didn't do much in the way of theatrics. Okay, but I think at the bottom of it all is, is the music great, or isn't it? If the music's great, a little bit of showmanship helps the medicine go down. And it's fun to watch, and it can get you written about and talked about. And so, from that point of view, I don't think it hurts at all. And in some senses, it does help to dramatize the music. Murray Lerner 29:52 How do you feel about singing? Versus playing is what do you feel when you sing? Greg Lake 29:57 Well sing is a very physical thing. brutally physical. And well, to be honest, just from that point of view, it's a very difficult thing. Because the stresses over your body are the wrong, really, it's very bad thing to do to play a guitar and sing, because you're doing the wrong things with your, the structure of your body is going into many different directions. But it's something you learn how to do and deal with. But I often wished that I only sang. Just I didn't have to do anything else. Because I could actually put more focus physically and mentally on singing. And funnily enough, when I was very young people sometimes used to come up to me and say, you should you should just sing, you know. And I often think I wonder what it would have been like, you know, if I'd have only son or not played and sang, but I do love the guitar. I love the guitar, or all forms of guitar, I cannot walk past a guitar shop without going in, or looking in the window to this day. And so I don't think I would be without, without the guitar in my life. Murray Lerner 31:11 But I had another question related to that. How do you feel when you do sing forgetting the guitar? Is there a different sense of a different kind of joy? Is it? What is it you feel when you sing that? What do you get out of singing? Greg Lake 31:28 It's direct communication, as opposed to translated communication. When I play a guitar, you have to manipulate the strings in order to make the sound to communicate with a voice, it's direct. There's no interface between my soul and the listeners ears. That's how I feel. It's direct communication. And an infinitely more controllable, you know, because it's your own body that you're moving to make the sound. Your instrument is in your body inside your body. And so it cannot be any more personal, any more intimate. Any more direct than singing. Any instrument is, there's what there's one step in between it and the person receiving it. So it's less direct, less intimate in that sense. But I have to say when you listen to some players, you really have to admire how they really use their instrument almost in a human way. We talked earlier about Jimmy, you almost felt that was his voice. When he played miles. You almost felt that was his voice. And it was it is so that you know the great players talk to you. Singers. It's easy for singers. There's nothing in between. Murray Lerner 33:05 Think you're right about Jimmy because when I added the the phone button, that's what I felt that was his voice, the machine gun and maybe there were five sentences or seven |
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