19901980s NEWS
The Eleventh Hour, SHOW #105
Show Title: Dark City (New York on Film)
Guests: Film Directors; Joan Micklin Silver, Paul Schrader, Richard Brown.
Description: Interviews with film writers and directors about the dark image of New York City as depicted in many feature length films creating a stereotypical image of the city.
Original Broadcast Date: 1-13-89
Show Title: Dark City (New York on Film)
Guests: Film Directors; Joan Micklin Silver, Paul Schrader, Richard Brown.
Description: Interviews with film writers and directors about the dark image of New York City as depicted in many feature length films creating a stereotypical image of the city.
Original Broadcast Date: 1-13-89
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| 00:01:49 0 |
Slate. The Eleventh Hour, Show 105, Dark City
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| 00:02:02 13.17 |
WNET New York Graphic
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| 00:02:12 23.26 |
Program funding and grants announced over The Eleventh Hour show graphic
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| 00:02:17 28.05 |
The Eleventh Hour show graphic and show opener
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| 00:02:43 53.98 |
Show host, Robert Lipsyte, welcomes viewers and introduces topic of today's show - movie makers in NYC, why do they come to NY, what do they see..
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| 00:03:35 106.27 |
Host Lipsyte announces guests, Film Directors - Joan Micklin Silver, Paul Shrader, Spike Lee as well as, "movie mavens" Richard Brown and Paul Arthur
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| 00:03:51 122.58 |
Host Lipsyte introduces clip from Joan Micklin Silver's latest movie.
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| 00:04:03 134.09 |
Clip from the movie, "Crossing Delancey Street"
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| 00:04:20 151.52 |
Host Lipsyte in studio and sitting on sofa with guest Film Director, Joan Micklin Silver (of "Hester Street" fame).
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| 00:04:33 164.14 |
Interview with Joan Micklin Silver
Robert Lipsyte: So Micklin Silver. Let's let's go back to your roots from when you were brought up outside Omaha, you didn't come to New York City was 17. And your first images of New York were probably from pictures. Joan Micklin Silver: Absolutely. They were from the movies. They were from Life magazine. They were even from things like the radio, you know, 8 million stories with a million people. 8 million stories. Grand Central Station? I guess it was, yeah. Robert Lipsyte: What was what was the New York in your mind? Joan Micklin Silver: Oh, a place of great possibility. Excitement, enchantment, sophistication. Robert Lipsyte: And then you got here at 17. You went to Sarah Lawrence? Joan Micklin Silver: Yes. Robert Lipsyte: And was it still excitement, enchantment? Joan Micklin Silver: Yes, absolutely. I've always had a love affair going with New York, although I'm aware enough to see that there are lots of aspects of New York that aren't too lovable. There's still a sense of possibility in the city for me, that's very exciting, and a sense of people brushing up against each other a sense of all sorts of people constantly in contact with each other. As opposed to say other cities where you get in a car drive to where you're going to park in a parking lot, go to the you know, enter the place and so on. Robert Lipsyte: When you work here. I mean, does the city take over? I mean, does it become a character in your work? Are you, are you in control of the city? Joan Micklin Silver: I don't think anybody's ever in control of the City of New York. A- New Yorkers are pretty jaded. And it's very hard to fall there. You can shoot in some places and say, "would you mind waiting a few minutes till we finish?" And people will say "Oh, not at all make your movie. Oh, please. Excuse me. I hope I didn't interfere." In New York, you're often going to get a reaction. I live here. This is my block, you don't own the sidewalks and you don't you know, you have to say yeah, you're right. Robert Lipsyte : Seems rational to me. Joan Micklin Silver: Absolutely. t's hard to shoot in New York. There's a lot of extraneous sound. There's a lot of sort of buzz but I think all that gets into the shots. I really do. I think there's a sense of just life and pulsing in New York that I appreciate very much. Robert Lipsyte: It helps the film. Joan Micklin Silver: I think so. Yeah. Robert Lipsyte: But I mean, New York is also so disparate in its way that there are a lot of ways to- you seem to approach it as a city of light and hope. Joan Micklin Silver: Well, yeah, I think so. Robert Lipsyte: That was that was certainly was the sense in the new film Crossing Delancey and then you brought another clip we can look at. Joan Micklin Silver: Okay |
| 00:06:31 282.03 |
Host Lipsyte and Micklin Silver, shot from behind, on sofa looking at small television.
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| 00:06:37 288.14 |
Cut to Clip from the Micklin Silver movie, "Crossing Delancey".
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| 00:07:04 315.15 |
Return to the studio, Lipsyte's interview with Micklin continues...
Robert Lipsyte: There are values in the Lower East Side for you that are worth saving. Um, there's also the sense in the film that they are butted up against values and other parts of the city that may not be worth saving, that are intrusive in people's lives. Joan Micklin Silver: Well, I think that one aspect of New York that Crossing Delancey does touch on is that there's a tremendous seductiveness to the superficial, to the packaging of things in New York. And it's something that often causes one to overlook, let's say the worth of someone like Sam. But I would like to say that one of the nice things about shooting in New York was that Sam, the character of Peter Riegert plays sells pickles and we use the last going pickle stand on the Lower East Side. And in fact, right across the street from it is this handball court, this playground. And it's nice to be able to use those things and not have to create them in film, but to really be able to use the things in the city as you find them Robert Lipsyte : For that sense of a city of light. Joan Micklin Silver. Thank you very much. And now for a very different point of view an essay from Paul Arthur, author of a forthcoming book Shadows On the Mirror. Paul author calls this essay The Dark City. |
| 00:08:11 382.62 |
Interview ends with Micklin Silver. Lipsyte introduces next segment and cuts to clip from the film, Taxi Driver
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| 00:08:25 396.46 |
Clip from the 1976 film, "Taxi Driver" .
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| 00:08:59 430 |
Clip ends and cut to tilt down on exterior historic Biograph Film Studios building in New York. Built circa 1912.
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| 00:09:06 437.02 |
Author, Paul Arthur, standing in front of the Biograph Film Studios' building explains a bit of the history of the 80 year old studio and the frequent filming taking place in the streets and parks of New York.
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| 00:09:12 443.36 |
Arthur cuts to B&W clip from the 1902 silent movie, "The Life of an American Fireman".
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| 00:09:26 457.39 |
Iconic Hollywood sign. (Unseen Paul Arthur explains that by end of WWI the movie industry fled to Southern California for economic reasons, but NY was actually fabricated in the films they made.
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| 00:09:32 463.24 |
Clip from a scene in the 1940 B&W comedy film, "His Girl Friday".
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| 00:09:55 485.94 |
1945 Newsreel footage of an atomic bomb explosion (actual footage of bombing over either Hiroshima or Nagasaki 1945)
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| 00:10:06 497.37 |
Vintage prop plane circa 1940's
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| 00:10:15 506.1 |
Aerial b&w newsreel footage (from a plane) over devastated war torn WWII cities.
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| 00:10:20 511.51 |
B&W clip from the 1949 suspense film noir movie, The Window.
Unseen author, Paul Arthur, explains over the film clip, how movie making returned to NY after WWII, becoming known as the "Dark City" |
| 00:10:54 545.51 |
Iconic B&W Film clip from "The Naked City" 1948.
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| 00:11:18 569.28 |
B&W film clip from the 1948 film, "Force of Evil".
Unseen Paul Arthur narrates over the clip - about how the films being made after the war depicted New York as dark, "crime ridden, a shooting gallery and slaughterhouse" and in fact, New York was decaying in reality. |
| 00:11:46 597.18 |
Film clip from 1956 movie, "The Wrong Man"
Unseen Paul Arthur continues to explain how the dark themes of the movies made about New York at the time were not unrealistic. |
| 00:12:09 619.82 |
B&W film clip from the 1953 movie, "Pick Up on South Street"
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| 00:12:24 635.62 |
Film Clip from the musical, "On the Town", circa 1949 - depicting the romantic side of New York
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| 00:12:50 661.32 |
Author Paul Arthur returns standing in front of the New York Union Square Subway Station.
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| 00:12:59 670.11 |
Romantic clip from the 1987 movie, "Moonstruck".
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| 00:13:27 697.91 |
Clip from the 1987 movie, "Fatal Attraction" . Paul Arthur, unseen, explains how there were 8 million stories in "the naked city". Mostly all dark stories.
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| 00:14:06 736.85 |
Host of the Eleventh Hour, Robert Lipsyte, returning to studio and introduces well-known writer, director (of the movies Taxi Driver, Raging Bull American Gigilo, and others), Paul Schrader.
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| 00:14:39 770.16 |
Interview with Paul Schrader
Robert Lipsyte: The first image in that essay was from Taxi Driver. That was dark city Indeed, the man who wrote Taxi Driver is with us. Paul Schrader writer, director, teacher, critic. I'm a fan of Hardcore and Raging Bull. And this year, he wrote The Last Temptation of Christ, and directed Patty Hearst. But Taxi Driver still kind of brings you back is the prince of the dark city. Paul Schrader: Yes. It was interesting about taxi driver, because at the time I wrote it, I was living in Los Angeles. And the experience that it is written about is of loneliness in a car, basically, loneliness in Los Angeles, yet it is set in New York. And why did I set it in New York? I didn't even know New York that well, I had the cabs the wrong color, I had the streets running the wrong way. But New York, you know, is in the national consciousness of the world consciousness, you know, the city of extremes, the sweatbox, where everything is so pressured and put together and pushed together, that the buildings have to grow ever taller and taller, just to, uh, you know, to accommodate the pressure. And so where else do you put this kind of nightmarish, paranoid figure of the American imagination who, who drifts around the city in this iron coffin? You put them in New York. And, and so I guess that essay is somewhat true. I know Hollywood does come to New York when it wants to reinforce those dark images. Robert Lipsyte: Well, you have a dark image of New York. Paul Schrader: Well, that film did. And and the only other film I wrote that was said, here was Raging Bull, which is also sort of dark. Now, when I wrote American Gigolo, I set it in Los Angeles, because to me, it was a much lighter city and a much. So I guess that the essay is sort of true. You know, we do fall into those, uh, stereotypes. Robert Lipsyte: What would you remember your own first images of you didn't go to a movie until you were 17 years old? Paul Schrader: (NT-3105) 14:14 Yeah. But actually, I came here to Columbia when somebody to see films because I had never seen the films, particularly our films. And, you know, my first image of New York was Morningside Heights, it was all very heavy and very exciting. But I guess that I, like all of us are sort of, programmed to in this way of New York being the city of extremes, the city where anything can happen, the city where crime k lurks at every corner, and that success lurks at every corner. And that the city of possibility. Robert Lipsyte : Do you think filmmakers abused New York in that sense? Paul Schrader: I think New York has become a symbol and, and therefore, the symbol feeds upon itself. And, and and New York likes being a symbol and it willfully feeds on itself. Robert Lipsyte: We'll be back in a moment with the film critic and teacher, Richard Brown. |
| 00:17:09 920.46 |
Interview ends. Host Lipsyte announces upcoming guest, Richard Brown.
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| 00:17:11 922.63 |
The Eleventh Hour show graphics
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| 00:17:20 931.19 |
Host Robert Lipsyte introduces his next guest, Richard Brown, film critic and teacher from The New School.
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| 00:17:37 948.37 |
Interview with Richard Brown (about the reasons why so many films are made in New York City.
Robert Lipsyte: Well, a new character has joined the scene, the leading man, among teachers of courses about film. Richard Brown of the New School. Richard, what did you think about the essay we just saw? Richard Brown : First of all, I love the essay. I love what it said, I love the clips. But I must tell you, I don't agree with it. But the premise of that essay that I saw. In fact, the premise of your show has been that there's a dichotomy, that New York is a grim, dark, horrible city that beats people down. That's true enough. The other premise is that occasionally, 10, 15% of the films, New York is a place that's kind of like a wonderland. like Oz. I'll tell you what my feeling is, in a nutshell. New York is portrayed in movies is neither of those. New York is a background. I just showed my class, a film called Working Girl. It's a terrific movie. The film is not about New York. And yet, I would submit to you that every frame of that movie is about New York City, even though in fact they doubled New York with Toronto, which they do with a lot of films. You showed a clip a little while ago from Moonstruck. Much of the exterior that is done for Moonstruck was also actually shot in Toronto, but the film is about New York. And the truth is that what you see in New York is a background. And that as grim as it is the graffiti on the subway, the crime, the brutality, the dirt of the city, it's all there. And yet it discourages nobody from coming to New York, it almost says to you, yes, this is a lousy place to live. The quality of life in the city is difficult, often oppressive. And yet, that's one of the things that challenges you. And I think that there are a lot of films like Arthur in the films, I've talked about, dozens of films, that use New York as a background in which the city itself becomes a third character, it becomes a critical character. Not because of what it does to people, and not because it's a fantasy land, but because there is a rhythm and vitality, if you will ,Bob to the city that is irresistible to some people. Robert Lipsyte: Yeah. Now that rhythm and that vitality is one of the reasons, of course, that filmmakers come here. But there are several other reasons, kind of subtext reasons. And Paul was talking about that. One is the fact that there's a national media here that can help you sell the film. And two, there's an economic reason for being here. |
| 00:18:01 972.24 |
Wide shot Host Lipsyte sitting in chair, guests Paul Schrader and Richard Brown on sofa in the studio. Interview with Brown and Schrader continues:
Robert Lipsyte: Yeah. Now that rhythm and that vitality is one of the reasons, of course, that filmmakers come here. But there are several other reasons, kind of subtext reasons. And Paul was talking about that. One is the fact that there's a national media here that can help you sell the film. And two, there's an economic reason for being here. Paul Schrader: Yeah, in fact that, you know, a New York movie goer is worth more say than an overall movie goer, one because the ticket price is higher, but also the percentage of the ticket price that goes back to the film company is higher. So that, you know, New York Film goers probably worth 1.6 film goers in Cincinnati. So you know, there is a financial incentive for film to do well in New York. Robert Lipsyte: And besides doing well, new if it's about New York, it would seem more enticing to a New Yorker. Paul Schrader: Yes New Yorkers love to think of themselves in this way. Robert Lipsyte: And then of course, there's medias is here. Paul Schrader: Yes. Yeah. I mean, you know, if you can make it here, you can make it anywhere. You know, this is a slogan near and dear to the hearts of all this New Yorkers. Robert Lipsyte: There's a lyric in that somewhere. Yeah. Do you think that there's such a thing as, you know, John Gardiner talks about the moral novel? Is there a moral film? Do filmmakers have any moral responsibility to New York or to any place that they set their films? Richard Brown: No, I don't think so. I think there are responsibilities to personal principles. And I think you can make an argument to say there's responsibility to human beings. But New York City is is a monolith. It's a place. It will serve the film industry. And so far as it makes a good background. Robert Lipsyte: New York City is a monolith. What does that mean? Richard Brown: What I mean, is that, that in this city, with all the diversity and all the 8 million stories, that there still is a common element that goes from corner to corner in the city that tells you that you're not in another city. Robert Lipsyte: What's that? Richard Brown: I think I touched on it before when I said that there's a rhythm here. And I think that as New Yorkers, we're not even aware of this almost urban metabolism until you go somewhere else. You have to go to Buffalo, to understand that New York is different. Robert Lipsyte: I think that's very parochial. And since you grew up in Queens, apparently, as I grew up in Queens. Richard Brown: Yes. Robert Lipsyte : And growing up in Queens, when we went to Manhattan, when we went to the "city". Richard Brown: That's right. It was called going to New York, right? Robert Lipsyte: The rhythms of Queens were not the same as the rhythms of Manhattan.- I don't really sense that there's a monolith. You couldn't really shoot in Queens or in Brooklyn and get the same textures that you would get in Manhattan. Paul Schrader: No. And if you look at these two success fables of the last couple decades- Saturday Night Fever and Working Girl, basically, you meet- all they are they're saying is that you can co come from Bay Ridge or you can come from Staten Island, and you can make it in Manhattan. Richard Brown: Okay, well, let me let me let me let me answer that. Paul Schrader: It's not true, of course. Yeah. But that's why we go to move. Richard Brown: Yeah, I'll make the case you and I like Paul's citation of Saturday Night Fever, which actually is a very interesting parallel to Working Girl. It's about people looking across the river and saying, I'm going to make it there. And I would submit to you that even though you're absolutely right, Staten Island, or Brooklyn does not look like Manhattan, Queens doesn't look like it. Our growing up was very different from a Manhattan child or my child. The fact is that you never forget that you're part of this metropolis, that growing up there is not the same thing as growing up in a suburb of Cleveland, or a suburb of Denver, that you are on the fringes and therefore you get it in a kind of wave, you get that sense of Manhattan. You know, Woody Allen said it in my class last year, he said, the thing I love about Manhattan is is the galleries and the symphony, and the ballet and the orchestras and all the other things I never do. And I think it was a very perceptive comment that we all of us benefit as New Yorkers from a tenor that the city has. It's very hard to isolate, but it's there, and I see it in the movies that come out. Robert Lipsyte: And we see it in the movies. We have to leave it there. Richard Brown, Paul Schrader, thanks a lot. There are corners in New York that rarely see a movie crew, Bedford Stuyvesant in Brooklyn for one, where the folks were very happy to see Spike Lee. |
| 00:23:20 1291.5 |
Host Lipsyte thanks Schrader and Brown and cuts to next segment on New York movie maker, Spike Lee.
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| 00:23:21 1292.19 |
Pan out on billboards in New York - "Bed-Stuy - Do or Die", "Brooklyn's Own - Mike Tyson"
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| 00:23:34 1305.3 |
Street scenes in Bedford Stuyvesant - African American pedestrians, group of teenage Black boys walking together down the block.
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| 00:23:38 1309.4 |
Tilt down, zoom in on plaque on sidewalk, reads: "on this Block in the Year of Our Lord, 1988, We filmed "Do the Right Thing" July 18, 1988 - September 9, 1988 - A Spike Lee Joint 40 Acres and a Mule"
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| 00:23:48 1319.06 |
Talking heads African American young man and teenage girl on the street in Bed Stuy talking about the filming of Spike Lee's movie. Both were cast by Lee to be in his film.
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| 00:24:25 1356.07 |
Cut to interview off set with Spike Lee about how Blacks are portrayed in movies
Unseen unknown Interviewer: How are blacks portrayed in movies? Spike Lee: They just haven't been truthful and the problem is that characters have been defined by people other than black. (Lee talks over a clip from a scene in "She's Gotta Have it"). In my films shown, to me, true life realities of black people and humanity. Spike Lee (unseen and speaking over film clip) And Hollywood is not in love with me. The only reason why I'm able to make those now is because, you know they make money. Lucky for me, they will sell their mother for money, so as long as I continue to, no matter how political my films get in the future, or how radical they get, as long as they make money, I'll still be able to make them. Robert Lipsyte still speaking over movie clip: Spike Lee breaks stereotypes. He's dubbed "leader of the black pack", an emerging group of young black filmmakers. She's gotta Have It star, Nola Darling, is an independent woman with three lovers. Spike Lee: speaking to unseen interviewer: And that's why I'm under attack a lot of black press because they feel that a lot of the characters I have in my film are not positive images, you know, but I feel that you can't have everybody in your films like the Huxtables I mean, that is to me, that'd be kind of boring, and it's not truthful either. Robert Lipsyte unseen and speaking over clip from "School Days" : His second feature, School Days. It dared to step into interracial controversy. The discrimination by blacks against blacks with darker skin and kinky hair. The film received mixed reviews, but Spike Lee marches to his own drummer. Spike Lee is heard speaking: I think Ryan Lyric is terrified by our inner city black youth- a mugger, rapists, drug pusher/dealer, and, I don't think that's the case. Is there one type of white film that comes out? No, so I don't understand why black people can't have the same diversities as any other people. I mean is not. I mean, that's why we just need more films because one or two films that come out of you by black people, they cannot represent or satisfy 25 million black peoples. And that's why I get a lot of flack like "Spike, why don't you do this?" or "Spike, why don't you do that?" Like, I'm just one filmmaker. |
| 00:25:05 1395.74 |
Clips from Spike Lee's first feature film in 1986, "She's Gotta Have It".
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| 00:25:59 1450.65 |
Another clip from "She's Gotta Have it"
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| 00:26:29 1479.71 |
Film clip from Lee's second feature film, "School Daze". (This one depicting albeit bravely, intra-racial controversy).
Unseen Lipsyte narrates over the clip - about the mixed reviews due to the movie's topic. |
| 00:26:52 1502.95 |
Spike Lee wearing baseball cap, is seen in his studio, directing the recording of music to his film, "Do the Right Thing".
Robert Lipsyte unseen: He's mixing music for his latest movie, Do the Right Thing, shot in Bedford Stuyvesant, Brooklyn. Spike Lee: This film is about a 24 hour period in New York City, the hottest day this summer, and it's how heat affects already tense race relations. |
| 00:27:07 1518.06 |
Two African American men at keyboards in recording studio
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| 00:27:14 1525.04 |
Close up Spike Lee, 1989
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| 00:27:22 1532.73 |
Wide shot interior recording studio. Three African American young men sitting at keyboards, computer, recording equipment on wall
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| 00:27:57 1568.28 |
Interview concludes, zoom out from small television. Host Robert Lipsyte in studio watching with coffee cup in hands. Lipsyte introduces the show and himself as show ends.
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| 00:28:07 1578.44 |
Credits over clips of program.
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| 00:28:38 1609.36 |
Funding and grants announced and overlay The Eleventh Hour graphic.
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| 00:28:48 1618.69 |
Reel ends.
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