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David Susskind in the studio opens show whose guests will be will be 5 porn movie stars.
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INSERT INTERVIEW
David Susskind: You are about to meet five porno movie stars whose films will never play your neighborhood theater. Please meet them now. First, Samantha Fox has starred in 100x rated films including roommates and Wanda Whips Wall Street. She gave up porno movies two years ago, and is now acting in mainstream films. Candida Royalle began her adult career starring in such films as Blue Magic, fascination and sizzle. Her latest erotic film is urban heat, which he wrote produced and co director Jack wrangler has made 85x rated films including Jack and Jill, which also starred Samantha fox as his wife, he also writes in direct for the legitimate stage, and he is the author of the jack wranglers story or what's a nice boy like you doing. Marc Stevens has been in the porno business for 20 years, and he's made over 600 features including deep throat and the devil in Miss Jones. He's written two books 10 and a half and making it big. Both autobiographical Gloria Leonard made her X ray to debut in the film Misty Beethoven and has since appeared in or directed over 30 Adult films. She helped launch high society magazine in 1976, and has been its publisher ever since. She also started the controversial dial-a-porn telephone hotline. Thank you all for being here. Gloria Leonard Thank you. I would like to if I may take just a little bit of issue with the introduction which said that we will never appear in anybody's neighborhood movie theater. We have in fact, I think appeared in many neighborhood movie theaters everybody's neighborhood. Yes. And we are also now appearing in your home Jack Wrangler There's one it Pittsburgh Pennsylvania has one I was there. Right next to the Pizza Hut David Susskind I know the neighborhood theater you're in a combat zone theater Samantha Fox No. What do you mean by combat zone Gloria Leonard Like Boston David Susskind Boston has a street one street which limits all you know dirty movies, and all peep shows and everything like that to that one street Samantha Fox So that would be the red light district and every every big city has that. But other neighborhoods that don't even are big enough to have a red light district they have porno films, Gloria Leonard We're even in shopping centers and malls where they have like a triplex or quadplex David Susskind You're making your work sound like the Red Cross. Gloria Leonard For some It is that believe it or not, I get letters at the magazine which indicate that we are in fact merciful to some people there that we have indeed, helped people who have low these many years made love with the lights off and didn't even know what their anatomy looked like. So to some extent, I guess we are the Red Cross or the a Blue Cross. Marc Stevens They're sort of like learning learning films, you can watch them and understand how to perform sexually a lot of people are you are nice that you do educational work. Well, some of the films are geared in that in that manner. People do learn from watching us on on the screen. Samantha Fox It's true. I was called on to a film I the jury as a matter of fact, you're on it. And we were our expertise was used for extreme close ups in there was a sexual therapy clinic for people in this mainstream Hollywood film and they called us to ask us what does it look like for people to have orgasms? No sag film actress could portray what it looks like to have an orgasm. And I'm not saying that we absolutely know, but we know that people's faces get grotesques and they and that they sweat. And, and Cadida Royalle Yes there was a close above the face Samantha Fox Close up of the face Gloria Leonard Sex is not the most graceful act in the world to begin with. I mean, in reality, David Susskind Oh, it's beautiful. Gloria Leonard Well, it's not that graceful looking to try and make it look graceful for it for the camera is no easy feat. And I think for a lot of people, there is a certain validation in what we do in that if a woman or a man has a certain sexual fantasy or a fetish. They may think that they're very alone that they are perverted in some way. And by seeing it either in films or in magazines. It validates the fact that there are other people out there doing exactly what they think is otherwise David Susskind Very special people, people without any restrictions in their conduct or behavior. I mean, seeing you do all the things Gloria, you ought to be ashamed. Gloria Leonard You also call them dirty movies. I think that sex is only dirty if you're doing it right. Jack Wrangler I'm really surprised that we got on the.. David Susskind What does that mean..sex is only dirty if you're doing it right. What do you mean? Gloria Leonard Well, it's sort of witty, I guess, catchphrase, there's a tendency to think too, for a lot of people out there that sex is bad. And that's why there is so much opposition to what we do. And the whole milieu of adult films and books and etc. I Don't think that sex is bad or that it is dirty. Unfortunately, we are. While we're trying very hard to change the public's opinion of that. I think that when the do's and the don'ts or the good and the bad lists were made up sex inadvertently got lumped into the wrong list. Marc Stevens Well, in the 20 years, I've been involved in X rated films. Nobody ever asked me to do anything really dirty, or anything that I wouldn't be able to handle in front of the camera. David Susskind Well is there anything that a man or a woman do with each other that you haven't done in your porno film? Well, I'm not talking about beading and that kind of sick, neurotic, psychotic stuff. Jack Wrangler And that's not yet we're not talking about that either. That has nothing to do with the X rated industry. That's the multibillion dollar industry. Well it's a Platform. I'm just surprised we got on a soapbox about all the great things about the X rated industry so fast in this show, because I think most of us do it. Because it's, it's supposed to be fun. It's like carny it's going to an amusement park. It's, it's delight. And sometimes it can be very dull, depending on the film. Samantha Fox Well, I always loved sex. Personally, it was something that instead of doing homework, I'd rather do sex as a very young person. And then when I had an opportunity to get paid for it, and to be chaperoned David Susskind Wait a minute. You were doing homework and doing sex. Samantha Fox No, no, I would rather do have sex as a younger person than do my homework. You know, I was really young when I started. Okay, so based on that premise, I just liked sex. And then here I was offered this acting career. You know, every girl wants to be a star. There's no one in America that at some point hasn't fantasized that they'd like to act in front of the camera. So that plus my favorite pastime plus getting paid for it was a good reason to get into it. And I think almost everyone here Jack Wrangler I think that's everybody's reason for getting into it David Susskind what age were you into it? |
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Samantha Fox
I started late getting paid for it. I started at 25 But I got involved very early in my personal life Gloria Leonard you think you got started late I was in my 30s when I got into this industry, which is hardly a time when a woman is thinking about becoming a sex symbol. So for me it was really a bizarre twist of fate David Susskind Why would seemingly normal decent American Why would all of you be in such a grubby business? Cadida Royalle I'll have you know There's actually some amount of glamour I mean, I think a lot of the reason that like we hear about dancers new dancers that dream of being in erotic films and because there is a certain amount of glamour in in the good quality films, you have makeup people you have scripts you've directed you have all the things that real Hollywood movies have Gloria Leonard regardless, regardless of what you're putting in front of the camera, it is still Lights Camera Action, it still has all the you know the machinations and all the requirements of whether you're shooting a horror film or, or a comedy movie making is very glamorous Samantha Fox and also if it's so grubby? Why are people making millions and billions and zillions of dollars? Someone is buying it. David Susskind Well, because the final porno film appeals to people's basis sex drive. Samantha Fox It does. Is that is that your feeling? David Susskind Yes. I think that it's used as a turn on for people, a man and a woman Marc Stevens David have you seen a lot of X rated movies. David Susskind No, I've seen deep throat and I've seen a recent masterpiece called roommates. Three of You are in it. Oh god things you're doing there. Gloria Leonard I don't have any sex very morals David Susskind You answered the door. Gloria Leonard No I play I play her madam. She's a retiring Samantha's retiring prostitute and I come to chew her out and try and dissuade her from leaving the business. Jack Wrangler You're a nasty lady. Gloria Leonard Yeah, Samantha Fox and look with what happens to me in the film. I fall in love with a regular guy. He dumps me and doesn't even tell me he's engaged to someone else. So much for nice guys, you know, Gloria Leonard Roomates is a very interesting example of the current trend toward appealing to more sophisticated adult audience in that I think it's a real feminist film because even though these women really get kind of trampled over to some extent by men, at the end, they keep on keeping on and I to me, that's a feminist kind of film and posture. David Susskind I thought the film was uniquely lacking story. Anything involving thematically me you didn't buy for a minute that she really had a problem and you just wanted to see her do it with him again, because they did it so well together. Samantha Fox You really didn't buy into it emotionally at all David Susskind No, three roommates an ex prostitute a model. And the third one was, I don't know, Gloria Leonard A California dip girl i Well, that was the model and then Veronica plays very serious Yale Drama student trying to make it on Broadway Samantha Fox Well I will agree with in that instance is that there's never enough time to develop characters because it's always a toss up on how much time we should give to seeing love scenes and how much time we should develop characters you know? Is 20 minutes here and 20 minutes there, then other people spend developing characters we are having sex Jack Wrangler like horror films that way you have a certain amount of plot to set up your characters just to get them in a situation where somebody heads gonna get chopped off and David Susskind I found it that kind of a sexual turn on Marc Stevens Years ago you'd just get on set and if you were there early enough you got to pick the girl you wanted to work with. And we just sort of made up the story as we went along the earlier films years ago Jack Wrangler Then they'd have what you called garden what I used to call garden hosing a scene where they would get to people who were very Randy animals together and they would just put a camera overhead and say go to it David Susskind that seems to be a repetitive pattern of uh conolingus Gloria Leonard the backbone of this business or maybe the front bone used to be wall to wall skin and and sexual activity with little rhyme and reason of Who are these people? How did they get there why are their clothes off? And now as I say there's there's more of an effort to make it a movie with sex. However, I think there will always be that that proverbial raincoat crowd that doesn't want the plot doesn't want the character development they just want the turn on for turn on sake I say fine. There should be as much material to appeal to as many varieties of tastes Jack Wrangler Well I know people that get the films and and they cut out all the dialogue and they just save the sex scenes and put them on a different tape David Susskind when you when you're at it, is that one continuous take Jack Wrangler No, no do you know sometimes takes five hours to shoot one love scene in a film. I know a film that I've got coming out in January, I found out that the first scene is 150 some odd cuts in just a three minute opening scene in the film. No, it's not done that way at all. But you do what you have about five minutes of the pistons in the Volkswagen and they shoot that first when you're shooting a love scene David Susskind pistons and Volkswagen what the hell are you talking about? Jack Wrangler Well the actual the actual physical thrust thing and the penetration and all that is done. First you shoot that then you'll shoot reactions you'll shoot all the foreplay and also these films are shot the love scenes are shot three different ways we shoot what's called a hard X version, a soft X and somebody should explain to me what that means. I don't know but that and then there's an R version that's made David Susskind So you make three versions of the same take of the same love thing. Yep, see Yeah, you're making love the same way. But we're covering cameras Gloria Leonard The cameras are positioned in enough different zones as to protect themselves so they can maximize the the distribution possibilities. David Susskind The roommates that I saw yesterday, your latest film your latest film that was the hard hard X Samantha Fox You saw close ups of genitalia. That's hard X Cadida Royalle I don't I have to take issue with all this because I don't shoot like that at all. My series is aimed at a very new growing market. And I really I take issue with a lot of things that have been said here. I don't think that all these movies are educational. And the reason that they look the way they should is because there's a standard formula. Well, that's a lot of you know, the different I think people do learn from it. But I think that a lot of it is done. The reason is a lot of is done by formula. There are certain things like when I started out my project, my new concept, people told me you must follow the formula or it won't sell David Susskind See these words, we don't know what the formula means Cadida Royalle The formula means. You must have conoingus you must have intercourse you must have a scene two women scene you know there's certain scenes you have to have and and I trashed all that I don't do any of that. I don't set the camera up in a static position in lots of different ways. In my movie you are seeing what really happened it really is shot as is I don't stop my action just because I want real heat. But most of the time the reason that some films look so mechanical is because they have to do it that way. Well, they set up the camera static and and you know, we're getting David Susskind Alright, we're getting awfully technical in film terms and you're saying that you shoot your sex scenes continuously? Cadida Royalle Yes David Susskind no 10 secons and stop. It's the whole thing. Jack Wrangler I've never done that Cadida Royalle No movie magic. David Susskind Could you manage it? Jack Wrangler I don't know. I'd be frightened. I would be really frightened Samantha Fox I could that's how you get real heat. David Susskind We're doing this while studying your grammar. We'll be right back |
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Break
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Back in Studio
INTERVIEW CONTINUES David Susskind I think for those who've seen porno films anywhere and at home lately, they're being bought in large numbers in a video disc stores Jack Wrangler I think it's the largest selling video that there is. Marc Stevens One out of three tapes is an x rated tape, David Susskind one of the three tape is X rated Marc Stevens X rated in the video market. Which is a big market. It's millions of dollars Gloria Leonard And more women than men are becoming the the consumer I've heard that Jack Wrangler I've heard that. More women now are going in and buying Marc Stevens We were talking before and it's funny in all the years I've been involved in X rated films, they're still films made by men for primarily a male audience. But of course, the home video has changed it now and women are saying it. And there are more women directors, and better scripts. I used to go on set in the morning, and work with women. I didn't even know the names David Susskind You made love to women on the set of a porno picture and You didn't know her name, or you didn't say she Marc Stevens It wasn't really important to to have communication with her. It was just the hardcore sex that they were interested in. That really hasn't changed a lot. It's still without the hardcore sex. Without the Hardcore sex what would roommates be? Cadida Royalle When I got into films, it was like a little clique. And everyone, every time I would do a film, it was like old homes week, it was meeting up with your old buddies again. Jack Wrangler Samatha has played my wife 15 times Gloria Leonard Now, I think any any filmmaker who was worth his salt in this industry will give the actors an opportunity to get to know one another other than in the biblical sense before they go out there and do get to know each other David Susskind How can you make love to each other, without some preparation or liking each other. I mean, other words, how is she in a condition of readiness? It's what do you do? Gloria Leonard it's an acting job. Samantha Fox I think the very honest encounter, more so than anything else I've experienced since in the real world, because I've done it for eight years. That was, that's what I did almost every day of my life for eight years. And to just walk on David Susskind You fornicated every day for 8 years. Samantha Fox No because it wasn't. Fornication is one of the words you could use, certainly. But it wasn't just that it was a certain tenderness and getting past the glossy bullshit of everyday living. I mean, there's so much lying and hardcore stuff that goes on without sex, that this was just right to the gut, because two people can't really touch each other or chemically. Not chemically, but have that chemistry, unless something is going on. And very often directors with just say, Cut, these two people aren't working out, we'll have to find someone else. Marc Stevens But the women have, it's so much easier on set. I mean, they really don't have to do hard work David Susskind your receivers. I mean, you could even fake orgasams that's the theorist, just one minute Samantha Fox We're actors and we could fake orgasms if we had to. But I think that part of the whole situation David Susskind No you are women and you could fake orgasm because women do and they aren't even actresses Samantha Fox that's true, well, then you can say that women that are off camera actresses to any female can fake orgasm. But David Susskind have you many times? In your work Samantha Fox Yes. Many times, of course. I mean, I was under conditions like being under hot lights. I wasn't feeling great. And it was an acting job. I wasn't there for my own pleasure. I was there to do a job and act. But for the most part, I felt great. You know, it is an aphrodisiac and it is in lieu of chemicals, you can feel good through sex. David Susskind You can, you did and you continue to Samantha Fox I no longer make X rated films. But they certainly have their place in my life. And it strengthened my feeling about how people can relate to each other on another level other than conversational, other than spiritual. David Susskind Came to work every day for eight years. And I had to make love I guess or fornicate Samantha Fox I made love or I fornicated or I had a good aggressive act with someone because very often I was angry at men, I'd walk on the set and I was just angry. I was having a problem in my life where I was angry at the man that was in my life. And sometimes I would take it out. Jack Wrangler You never did that with me David Susskind You two have played with each other all the time. Can you tell when she's faking it? Jack Wrangler I know one day when we were both surprised, and we weren't that we were in San Francisco making a film and at the beginning of the thing. Sam had a monologue that he had to say, and I was supposed to be under the sheets, and I could have faked anything I wanted to and I didn't and all of a sudden Sam got very involved in it. Samantha Fox He wasn't faking it. I had to deliver this monologue and all of a sudden it was like I said, I know Jack, what are you doing? Like? What's the matter? And I said I can't say lines and have good sex at the same time. I mean, I really couldn't Jack Wrangler We became great friends. Yeah, it was more like But I've never been like that for me. I don't want to sound incestual but I felt more like she was my sister. Cadida Royalle And and that happens a lot. A lot of people ask me, gee, did you get anything out of being in the business and I tell them I got a lot of wonderful For friends, I got my husband. And the thing is that people don't realize, David Susskind is your husband an actor? Cadida Royalle no, he's a producer. And he works in legit films now, but he started out learning his craft that way David Susskind did he observe you in action Cadida Royalle that's how I met him because he hired me for one of his productions. And he would never observe me, but he never let it interfere with our relationship. He knew it was a job for me David Susskind He never observed you. He was on the on the job he was on. Cadida Royalle That's right. But he didn't stand around the set it's a very closed set when you actually make love. Marc Stevens That's a little difficult When you're on set with working with some woman, the husband is standing 10 feet away, and I look up at him and you can see that he's angry or upset. Jack Wrangler they very seldom ever allow that Marc Stevens And I have to concentrate on on what I'm doing, which makes it difficult. David Susskind Now when you look up and see the husband, do you just descend? Are you finished Marc Stevens No I just sort of try to block them out and think of the money the money gets me excited David Susskind While you're going it you are thinking of the money? Marc Stevens Well while I'm doing it I think about the money Gloria Leonard Samantha made an interesting observation about it being very honest, area to work in. And I feel it's particularly honest in that for example, if you go see an R rated motion picture, generally an R rated film is R rated because of either the nudity, the violence and or the language and frequently a combination of all three, however, the nudity is inevitably female nudity. I mean, with one or two exceptions. Do we ever see any male nudity in an R rated film David Susskind Why would you want to see male nudity? Gloria Leonard Because I would like to see male nudity Jack Wrangler Well, I figured if we go to the gym and we clean ourselves up i would like to be seen Gloria Leonard let me just finish the point. The point is that in an X rated film, when you go in, it's much more honest that you know exactly what you're going to see there are no surprises. And it is more honest in that regard in R rated films, I think it's rather deceptive Marc Stevens That's very true, yes, absolutely. Samantha Fox You remember Caligula David Susskind I didn't see Caligula Samantha Fox What a big poo poo. Sir John Gill good is with all these new nymphet and young people around him and everything and Roddy McDowell if some everyone was sewing everyone Malcolm McDowell David Susskind It's known as Gucciano's fiasco Samantha Fox And you know, that was like worse than a bad X. And they were trying to make pretense that it was an R but they had hardcore. And people weren't sure about what they were getting. And I think that's unfair is when there's a masking David Susskind Well people are sure of what they're getting when they get you and get your pictures. Samantha Fox And I surprised them I did cameos I did a nun cameo once.I played in nun kept my clothes on it no sex and got paid a nice wage that day. Marc Stevens I think that's such a small group of us that we've maintained a friendship and it is now easier to work with various people, you get to choose who you want to work with. David Susskind How many people are on the set when you're having a love scene? Jack Wrangler Depends on the film. and the backers Marc Stevens it's true. A lot of backers want to hang out and watch. Jack Wrangler Most of the films that I've done have been forced, like platinum productions, and that none of that is allowed. There's only only people are allowed on the set or the people that are absolutely, absolutely required, and maybe 10-15 People at the most Marc Stevens I think if you speak up when you're doing a film and you say you want to close set, they will absolutely close the set down and you work with just the lighting people. Yeah, the camera man, Jack Wrangler I'm nearsighted. So it doesn't make any difference David Susskind when it's your turn to make the big fornication, you go in a dressing room and work yourself talk to myself talk, yes. Talk to yourself. Jack Wrangler Sometimes I do and sometimes they're on such a tight schedule that I don't have the time and the dressing room to get to it. You have to maneuver over so many things, I just say what the hell and and stay there and concentrate. David Susskind do you think your way into erection Jack Wrangler with a little help from my hands. Yeah. Marc Stevens Or you bring a loved one with you. Jack Wrangler I've never done that either. Because I always felt that would be insulting to the girl that I'm with and I don't want to mess the Girls Makeup up before the the the actual shooting of the scenes. So I don't like her to have to do anything. So I generally do it all by myself. Cadida Royalle Many men are not considerate as you Jack. A lot of times it's left up to the women sometimes you get an actor who if you know you have to be there to service him and help them get it up and you to excluded but sometimes it's very rough on the women that they it's it's almost like not only are you there to act, but you have to always get the guy ready and keep him ready Gloria Leonard Except that so called Money shot in our films. Is the is the male orgasm and David Susskind the money shot. Gloria Leonard Yeah, the money shot and basically, it is I think largely incumbent upon the woman to tune out her own sexuality in favor of the male's rhythm because women as you said Can Fake ecstasy and orgasm and unfortunately there are millions of women doing it across the bedrooms of American nightly, but you cannot fake a male erection and consequently I think that you have to give up a little of your own sexuality when in the scene David Susskind Is your condition of readiness, the female is that are you aided and abetted with vaseline or other equipment Samantha Fox that's required if it's anything we want, I always felt that I was a geisha. And I brought my own accoutrements, David Susskind what is it what would be Samantha Fox would be lotions, I had this thing called emotion lotion. And it was there was a pineapple apple and made no really great stuff and you put it on the skin and rub it and it makes the skin hot. So it's that that was one nicely and then some and like ice, you know, they liked ice in the right places. And some men just like to be pampered and caught a little nice massage or whatever. I mean, I felt like a geisha and I enjoyed myself. I'm very tactile and I really liked that part of it. I liked pleasing my partner. Jack Wrangler Samantha is very warm and Sweet on the set. And she's also real funny. Marc Stevens Well they they also give you enough time to sort of get it on privately, they'll all leave the room. So you can sort of get started. Gloria Leonard Yes and if the male is having a problem, they will kill the lights and say a little prayer and some privacy to get into a state of readiness David Susskind Then if you are you must work very quickly, you must get to the subject. The lady Yeah. And they've got to get the lights up. Jack Wrangler That's why you do that first and then go back and pick up the foreplay a lot. It's not one other thing. We don't necessarily orgasms are not required that much by men anymore in films, because they found out that a lot of women find that very unattractive. And since we have a large female audience now, the orgasms very often are not required. Marc Stevens I don't believe that David Susskind We will have to pause. We will be right back. |
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Back in Studio
INTERVIEW CONTINUES: David Susskind Candida do you want to quarrel with Jack? About all that Cadida Royalle Well, no, I don't want to quarrel with Jack. I just want to point that you brought up the fact that many women are buying cassettes now. And that's why I've started my company I have a company called femme productions, which is now doing movies created completely by women for the growing female audience and couple's audience and we don't have any come shots. And we don't have all those traditional genital close ups because I don't believe that that's what the people really want to see. All right, the new growing audience David Susskind Men want to see what they're now getting. They want to see the whole caboodle. Jack Wrangler Yeah And I think with a little rougher texture than what we're giving them now. I think we are in danger of getting a little too slick. Gloria Leonard Oh no accepting of you seeing there is an awful there's a glut right now a video made shot on video for the home video market of X rated stuff. And a lot of it is quite crappy and quite shabby. And it's interesting because the very first X rated films were an eight millimeter. I mean, that was what we called loops. Those were the very first that were available for home consumption. And then technology came along and we had a 16 millimeter and subsequently 35 millimeter and panna vision. And now suddenly, we have discovered video regrettably, though, a lot of what is on video the technology has changed but we're shooting the same old junk that was on eight millimeter. And not not all there is a lot of junk there's a great glut of poorly made product David Susskind is the camera shot of fornication. Junk Gloria Leonard no depends on how it's shot. Someone once asked me the difference between erotica and pornography you know what the answer is? The lighting is very murky and mysterious. It's sort of erotic if it's if it's rather blatant and high society kind of lighting Marc Stevens Well I've worked with a lot of female directors and the film's the the film was still the same at the end. David Susskind There just so many positions. Just so many things. The man eats the woman the woman practice fellatio on the man. It's just a question of close shots or Cadida Royalle It used to be a question of close shots. That's why we've got to break those formulas and tell people know people are ready for something new and artistic. I don't feel my stuff that way and people love it. David Susskind Your filming Stuff knowing that women are buying 50% of the dirty movies Cadida Royalle And men. Men love. I'm getting a teriffic response from men. And women are going to lead the men David Susskind Let's get specific women do not want to see the in and out thrust. Cadida Royalle No one everyone I speak to for men and women says to me Why do they have to have those long close ups its saturation, it gets boring. No one wants to see 10 minutes David Susskind attending to the female fantasy of the attenuated love making Cadida Royalle I feel that I'm presenting sexuality that everyone can benefit from watching and it does not focus on merely the genital shots of intercourse I show foreplay. I show sensuality I show eye contact touching. I show after play. I show people giggling and stroking each other after Because I show women getting off, and I do all this without come shots and close ups and I think, yeah, believe it or not reaching orgasm Gloria Leonard in defense of Cadida And not that she needs any defending she has really taken a risk in that what she is producing is really a departure from the so called norm of what's available, and that it is more of a background for lovemaking. It's almost like MTV with sex. It's not compelling when you are David Susskind You're always on a theoretical level. Yes, but you play very basic parts. You You were one of the staple women. Yes. In dirty pictures. Now you're kind of the Albert Einstein Gloria Leonard Thank you for the complement. But I think my niche David Susskind You quit because you made enough money and you didn't want it? Gloria Leonard no, it wasn't that I made my first X rated film this. This past year. For the first time in five years, I had retired as a Samantha had. Primarily because the parts for me as a more mature lady were rather gratuitous and repetitive and stereotypical David Susskind What's wrong with getting it on with the landlady Gloria Leonard because it became redundant. And I also resented working one or two days on a film, and then a year later seeing my name this big on the marquee. David Susskind Well, we're off the subject you she's revolutionized? Gloria Leonard Yes I think what Candida is has done with her femme line of video is very different. And interestingly enough, the feminist the more radical militant feminist groups, of course, always accused the women particularly in this business of, of helping to perpetuate a form of exploitation. And interestingly enough Candida has sort of generated a camp a feminist follower David Susskind What are you doing that would interest a man and a woman? Cadida Royalle I feel that I'm showing movies at a very sensual very hot just as hot very erotic that also teaches well as entertain they'll show people really how to pleasure one another it pleasures the man pleasures the women just as the woman pleasures, the man David Susskind How is that different from what we now see, Cadida Royalle because traditional male, traditional male pornography, but traditional pornography has catered to the male interest it started as an industry for men way, way back. And it's still kind of in that mode. You know, it's only in the last 10 years that we've been except the women are interested in sex. And so the industry is slow to change because it's mostly run by man. David Susskind No but if you show a lot of tentative touching, Cadida Royalle I don't show a lot of just tentative touching. I don't I don't believe in in waves crashing Fade to black. I don't believe women want to see knights on horses and that kind of thing. They want to see the real thing just as any man does. It's just a matter of doing it more artistically more sexually and more joyfully and realistically, so that it doesn't embarrass anyone David Susskind How does that strike you Jack? Jack Wrangler Well I like the way she treats men in her films. I get beat up and a lot. I get slugged by women a lot and raped and all kinds of her films that men are they they treat them a lot nicer. Marc Stevens I think there's a fine line between art films, or and the hardcore films. David Susskind How could you possibly do 600 X porno films. you are getting getting in shape less easily these days? Marc Stevens Well, I'm in I'm still in good shape. David Susskind I don't mean Marc Stevens I can still get it up. David Susskind You can? On demand Marc Stevens absolutely. I think most often asked was was. Do you still like sex after appearing in so many films and so many scenes working every day for 15 years? Absolutely. I still love sex a lot and having films that Jack Wrangler How many films did you have to do a day in order to have done 600. Marc Stevens Well a lot of films were shot over a weekend or in a day. Remember the one day wonders or the weekend wonder. Yeah, they're back. I don't really David Susskind Are you married? Marc Stevens I've been married a couple of times. David Susskind How did your wives feel? Marc Stevens They were part of, of the film industry. They worked with me. A lot of mates have come out of the business. It's a good way A lot of people meet each other. David Susskind Once you were married did you want her to continue her work? you didn't mind. Marc Stevens You need a special kind of I mean, you really have to be an exhibitionist. I just was born that way. Gloria Leonard I also think we're sitting here we're all tending to, in a way whitewash the industry, which by by no means has been awful. It's been wonderful experience for all of us. But it also has not been without a myriad of problems for many of us. Jack Wrangler And also we're really lucky. We're sort of the cream of this group were the ones that came out sane and they were the ones that made the films that they sold the television and all the other things Gloria Leonard Candida and I are part of a of an ongoing support group that has been meeting for about two and a half three years. No seriously. David Susskind You're into Therapy. Gloria Leonard Yes. It's it's it's a form of self help that has been a tremendous catharsis for the five of us. As a matter of fact I have seen Candida grow. No, because even though Candida had quit when when we started this this support group, she was feeling badly about herself and her participation in the business and in a little insecure, and she has in two or three years transformed. David Susskind Hold it right there. shouldn't you feel shoddy and bad about the business because the business is denigrating and debasing. It's a business of Cadida Royalle we all feel that way. Because people tell us what you tell us, we feel that way. Because society says that explicit sexual material is bad, and you should be guilty. And I don't believe that explicit is nothing wrong with explicitly erotic material. If you think there's something wrong with that there's something wrong with making that Gloria Leonard there is the old double standard, the guys are studs, and we're sluts, Marc Stevens I get a pat on the back and they say go to it. You know, this is okay. David Susskind No I think you're as bad as she is. Samantha Fox sort of interesting. It's like what you said, you had a gentleman, friend come to visit you yesterday in your office, and you had my tape on and David Susskind I had your tape on Samantha Fox and he knew who I was. David Susskind He said there is Samantha Fox, Samantha Fox but these are the very same people that probably they knew I was Samantha Fox wouldn't hire me for another job that I'm very capable of doing with my clothes Gloria Leonard But they would look at her film and love it. David Susskind Yeah, because there's a patina of dirt Jack Wrangler Well, also, Samantha Fox Well why do you think that is because you it's an answer that we're in it David Susskind It's because you're fornicating for money publicly and demonstrably you're, Samantha Fox and is there something David Susskind You are taking a sacred act that we are taught by our parents and by religions, and school, we've been taught that this is a sacred, intimate thing between two people who should care about each other, your commercialixing. Come right back to you're giving me hell? And one minute. |
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INTERVIEW CONTINUES David Susskind Okay, Samantha, what did you want to say? Samantha Fox I say that we've been commercializing sex and of that we are guilty. But does National Geographic commercialized nature, you know, does is that taking a sacred thing, our world, our beautiful world and putting it in a magazine? David Susskind No You can't make these Jack Wrangler See I think there's a big difference between making love on the screen and your own personal life. I've never, I've always had a big line between the two. I live with Margaret whiting, the singer and of our personal life, we don't I don't go home and she doesn't ask me. How are things at the office today? She here she was in one of my films, just the back of her head. She'll be delighted that I know that I said this, right. This was our Alfred Hitchcock she was there was the one in an extra and in a scene, that final scene of Jack and Jill was Samantha and I when we get married, and the back you see this big mink coat and a lot of blond hair behind me and that's Margaret poor Margaret. But we don't associate the two. I feel when I'm making a film, that it's part of the character that he makes love in whatever way that character makes love. And I don't have it doesn't have anything. Jack Wrangler Jack You go home every day and Margaret knows that. You have spent the day fornicating with some leading lady Jack Wrangler not every day on my films David Susskind No no occasional sabbatical,but what does she does she ever refer to it? Jack Wrangler She doesn't like the fact that I'm in it at all David Susskind Does she ever say hey, why don't you get out of that? Jack Wrangler Oh every day. David Susskind Oh, she does? Jack Wrangler Oh, sure. She didn't want me and when I first got but except that I was in it when she met me. Marc Stevens It's tough getting out of it. Once you're established. We all have that stigma. Cadida Royalle but listen, we change the subject. I would like to ask you this. Do you feel the same way about people that are performing sex for true sex education tapes, there are people that hire people. They're like medical companies clinical or their churches and they will hire you to they've hired some of the stores in our business to come and make love with a camera for clinical how to tapes now that those two people don't know each other. Do you think that that's David Susskind If the objective is educational, and medical? No, that's acceptable. Cadida Royalle But David the only readily available educational material we have for people to learn from is the material that our industry turns out. It really is. How else do we learn and I personally David Susskind Do you think that any red blooded man or woman in this country today somewhere between the ages of 21 and 45 is not sufficiently acquainted with the making love process. Cadida Royalle Oh, if you go into the back woods. If you go into the backwoods and half of those men don't really know how the women get off Gloria Leonard I get a lot of letters from from people saying that the how appreciative they are of the material because they were so naive about their own sexuality. Jack Wrangler I get a lot of letters from couples. David Susskind What have they learned from you Jack Wrangler No with me they say that marriage maybe was getting a little dull or going on the rocks and by watching the films they were Beginning to enjoy their marriage life again. David Susskind Hold it. What do you think he or she meant by that? He didn't practice oral sex before? Jack Wrangler No, I think that they saw such abandonment and and good humor and what we were doing that suddenly they it got rid of a lot of their own inhabitions and frustration. David Susskind You're selecting grace notes, you're not talking about that. Cadida Royalle They needed added fantasy material, they wanted some extra David Susskind They sit around the bedroom, turn on the movie, and prepare themselves for lovemaking. Gloria Leonard Yeah, I think so the number one, the number one killer of marriage or or commit commitment in a relationship is boredom. And it's usually sexual boredom. And this kind of material in many situations does act as an aid and enhancement. A lot of therapists are recommending the use the incorporation of this material for anything Samantha Fox I think the boredom starts a lot earlier in a relationship, I really do begin that believe that a relationship begins with understanding and being able to relate with your clothes on to some degree, but there are certainly people that can do that. And then they just become good friends. And there's nothing more sometimes they do need the sex films to enhance their lives. David Susskind Then let's clear it up. You mean that these porno movies are helpful, in your view, with couples across the country as a conditioner of pre conditioner as a kind of foreplay to love making Jack Wrangler Well, yeah, but I also think that they're David Susskind Because they do turn you on. I saw your film, you know, and I didn't I resisted it as much as I could. Jack Wrangler You had a meeting while I David Susskind No. I had to turn it off. But it would not turn me on it would be if I stayed with it, it would be depressing because you do it so many times. Jack Wrangler What I don't know but a lot of people don't run them all the way through, you know, they they start them and then they're off on their own. We just give them a boost. David Susskind Several things. I just want to come and call a spade a spade and for a man, it's very depressing your performances because number one, you're so large Jack Wrangler Well the screens are big and you look large. Marc Stevens They shoot from under neath to make it look bigger Jack Wrangler I look bigger All Over. I'm a little guy. You look taller. We're on the screen. Marc Stevens If you're in the front row and watching me on any screen on an 80 foot screen that happens to really sort of blow your mind out. I mean, that's really big. Yeah, surely. Jack Wrangler But you life your eyebrows and it goes 12 feet you can imagine when Cadida Royalle I when I would do personal appearances, these men would come up to me and say, Why are you just a little thing? They thought I was this big, you know, strapping woman up there because it makes you look larger than life. And the same thing with the men they see gee, how did those men get so bad? They're not so bad. Jack Wrangler Well, I would have if I was that large, I would have a complex about Gloria Leonard Men are probably intimidated by guys like you because a size sometimes is a factor that enters into it and also stamina, they think that it's not David Susskind I was coming to that. stamina Hey, this guy goes on forever. Gloria Leonard No he doesn't Marc Stevens People would stop me and say how can you do that? I saw you on a film and it's an hour film. And they saw me get off six times. What they didn't realize is that it took me six days to shoot this film. And it's cut and edited obviously and and put in Samantha Fox We are athletic David we are an athletic breed of people. we're very physical. Jack Wrangler But we're not abnormal about it. We're not freaks about it or anything. Gloria Leonard Yeah, I don't think any of us here promote the idea that all we are going to do with our lives is eat, drink, breathe and sleep. Sex is an element of our lives. But certainly it is not our whole life. Marc Stevens To do that, I love it. I think that's what attracted me to X films Jack Wrangler Boy it didn't with me. I did it because I was insecure physically. And I wanted somebody to give me a seal of approval. I did it because I felt unattractive. I felt that nobody desired me. And I didn't want to be wanted for my intellect or my wit. I wanted to be lusted after I really wanted that and then I didn't get the Brady Bunch and that was it. Cadida Royalle I did too. You know a lot of people are very shocked when I tell them they assume that we all especially the women go into the business because we think we're so gorgeous and we're so confident and I actually gained confidence through being in these films I needed that that boost and that adulation about myself. Gloria Leonard And you just said to Jack something about women are more interested not necessarily in how you look at what you hear per And you were concerned that I wasn't expressing myself personally, is that I prefer for a man to seduce me intellectually or cerebrally before I'm talking about off camera before I will go to bed with somebody I have to find some kind of intellectual rapport and of course humor is a real requirement David Susskind Have you find any tonight? Gloria Leonard what are you doing later? David Susskind We're pausing again we'll be right back |
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David and guests return to studio
INSERT INTERVIEW David Susskind did you want to say something? Samantha Fox Well, we were talking about you can't go back to Hollywood. Jack was saying David Susskind Once you've made dirty movies Samantha Fox right and David Susskind They peg you, right. Thye're porno movies, I'm sorry. Samantha Fox Erotic Films David Susskind If you say Adult Films people no one will know what you mean Gloria Leonard porno if you look it up in the dictionary. It has all this negative baggage of lewd and lascivious and I don't think making love is either of those things. David Susskind Making love exhibition exhibitionistically. Is is pretty cruddy. Gloria Leonard In whose opinion? David Susskind In the opinion of the people of the United States Gloria Leonard Who are buying it all. Who can't wait to run home and see our movies Cadida Royalle How hypocritical look at the sales. Who is buying it. The same people that say it's cruddy is a cruddy for them to watch it. David Susskind Yeah I think it's kind of cruddy to watch it Cadida Royalle We've got a cruddy country then. David Susskind Because I've never bought one. I mean, I've never watched I did go to one picture called the first one big, Deep Throat Gloria Leonard But what offends me is that those who who feel that what we do somehow is is wrong or bad. Think nothing about letting their children or themselves watch movies like Rambo or the a team where violence is considered, you know, part of our everyday nutritional diet. And I don't understand why people say, Well, these kind of movies go make people want to run out and commit rapes and murders. Well, if you're going to use that analogy, that sexual material promotes that kind of behavior, then you have to also consider that all that violence that people watch, must, it stands to reason do likewise David Susskind They are equal sins but not equally regarded Jack Wrangler I do think that people uh you can find things better maybe to do with your time, perhaps than to see an X rated film. But that's been true of saying, I shouldn't go see a carnival today because I should be home reading a good book. I mean, why not? It's fun. And it shouldn't be taken as any more than that. Poor Samantha was about to talk about her wonderful crossover films. Samantha Fox You are so sweet. Thank you, Jack. No, I did a film recently in Rome with Donald Pleasance. And in the film, I kept my clothes on most of the time, and I'm this main woman of Pompeii. However, at night, I play a gusta I go to these courts, these brothels and I act out lasciviously. So I got to play both sides of the role. And both sides of the coin. I mean, and it was interesting, I really didn't see any difference. I mean, an actress is asked to sometimes keep her clothes on and sometimes take them off. It's it's part of life. You know, Jack Wrangler I don't think that there's going to be that many X rated actors that end up doing legitimate films, not necessarily because of any hypocrisy from Hollywood but because there's so many great actors that are all over that haven't done X rated films. Why bother? Why bother? David Susskind Also I think you are labeled. You're stigmatized Jack Wrangler If you are boxed out. Yes, as a personality if it's a personality you have are selling tickets and they said gee, put them in the film because he'll sell tickets for us then they would in a second Cadida Royalle Also most actors and actresses in X rated films are not looking for a major Hollywood career. I certainly wasn't I was no fool. I didn't go in thinking this was going to catapult me to stardom. Gloria Leonard No, but it has opened doors for all David Susskind How does it affect the lives of people you love and who love you, your friends, your family? Jack Wrangler Well, if your guy most of your most of your men friends think your cock of the walk, you know that they think they command a certain amount of respect for having done it. It also can stop a cocktail party cold. David Susskind Oh yeah, I would think so Jack Wrangler If somebody asked you what you do. If it's a very straight cocktail party, it's a ball. David Susskind You know what you just say today. You say what do you do you say today? I fornicated seven times. Marc Stevens I tried getting away from X rated films for five years, but it was really difficult because the films are still seen and when you walk into a room, it seems that you get the spotlight, X rated film star. People want to talk to you about it. They have a lot of questions. They are very interested David Susskind I'll let you know I've cleard up all my questions. when I heard that size and duration are invented on the set by camera lenses. Jack Wrangler I'm glad that makes you feel better. Gloria Leonard I would like to say though that right relation to what Jack was just saying that men are you know, they're the studs. And somehow we wind up being the sluts in the business. It has been difficult for me in terms of maintaining personal relationships, particularly with men, because once they know who I am, and the business that I'm involved in, there is a tendency for them to, to be intimidated by me. And they generally react in one of two ways. One is either they think you're really easy and very, they'll be very crass and hit on you and expect every unspeakable act that there is. On the other hand, there are men who are put off by what they perceive to be some kind of prowess that I have that they don't think they can impress me in any way. So it has not been very easy have men. Well, it has not solved or resolved in that I'm still trying to work that out. And it's really more of their problem than it is mine. I'm rather confident and secure and who I am. And there is more to me than just being an adult film star. Jack Wrangler I think it's easier for guys, I think it's it's also much more difficult emotionally for a woman on a set. I think that a woman goes through more on the set psychologically than a man does. Because we've never been taught that it wasn't wrong to go out and make it with a whole lot of women on screen around. That's part of being a stud, right? That's fair, but a woman she is sacrificing. I think sometimes she may feel she isn't. But she may feel that she's sacrificing a certain amount of her femininity, a certain amount of what is very personal and private to her because that's the way women have been taught. It's a double standard. And I'm much more concerned for a woman emotionally on the set than I am for a guy. Cadida Royalle It is it can be hard on on us emotionally. I know that it was difficult on me because I didn't feel there was anything fundamentally wrong with portraying people making love. But I did resent very often the way it was filmed I could see right then and there that they were filming me in a very crass manner and that wasn't necessary. And that used to make me feel embarrassed. David Susskind How can you tell as somebody who makes film How can you the actor tell what they're photographing? Except if they're underneath you Jack Wrangler when you get a third eye to it just as any actor does? Marc Stevens You know exactly be aware of where the camera is. Cadida Royalle Oh, yeah, you must know where the camera is Marc Stevens the climax is very important the money shot David Susskind Oh the climax, that's one thing that otta be eliminated from X films Jack Wrangler well there do as we said, they're doing it a lot now David Susskind For whom is that shot? Jack Wrangler They used to think it was for us for the guys. That the man wanted it. Marc Stevens That was the absolute proof that we really are engaged in sex David Susskind By seeing ejaculation means you really do it Jack Wrangler That was what that was all about. So they could sell the films more that way. And again, it became part of the format requirement. There had to be a sex scene every three minutes or something in a film. It had to last a certain length. There had to be certain acts performed people Cadida Royalle People were wanting my backers. So don't let her do that. Don't let her eliminate those comes scenes David Susskind In this film that I saw. Well, I saw about 60% But you deal with Jack Wrangler. Happily for him, and then you run to the bathroom door. Isn't that a off putting thing? Samantha Fox No, I didn't do that in our love scene at all. David Susskind Yes you did Samantha Fox I think I think what happened was, um, we heard a sound we will make we will make. Yeah, we thought we were gonna wake up my roommate. And we found out that she just walked in from a night of carousing. And then in fact, we didn't need to be so quiet. But there is a bathroom scene in there because there's a man that's blackmailing me in the film, all along on my job. So he drags me into a bathroom. In the office. Gloria Leonard You mjust Watch it again. David Susskind Oh, I couldn't watch it again. I mean, it was pretty Gloria Leonard what's interesting is that what hasn't come up during our discussion here is the fact that certain social diseases he's Yeah, you know, might be considered something that is inherent biology David Susskind How do you deal when you make love to one two or three women in the case one of these pictures how do you deal with AIDS and Herpes Jack Wrangler Well, this time with the AIDS thing? I'm don't know whether I'm going to make a film until they find out what to do Marc Stevens I think a lot of performers now are backing away. I've spoken to a lot of my friends male stars as well as a female stars. And they are doing less films I think they want proof maybe a blood test David Susskind Do you use condoms now? Cadida Royalle occasionally David Susskind What makes a woman in a sex movie porno picture what makes her sex draw a star because not the acting because there's very little act. Is it the way that she reacts? Samantha Fox Well, in my in my case, I just thought it was phenomenal to suddenly be Star was this hot item. Suddenly I did one film and I was picked up right away. It doesn't happen like that with most of the girls. They have to either go through like many many films before they're discovered my first film I was up We have Oscars. We have the erotic Oscars and the best for best actress best sex scene best director. The whole thing Jack Wrangler I got best score one year I scored one one that Gloria Leonard I've been nominated five times. I've never ever won. Samantha Fox He made beautiful Music and Gloria was up many times and I don't see why she didn't win. But I was just hot. I've won many, many times. David Susskind Well, you act I saw you yesterday in the films Gloria Leonard Acting has become criteria in these motion pictures David Susskind you do wonderful. Samantha Fox Well, thank you. Are you talking about in the sex scenes or with my clothes on because I can actually act as well as emote? You know, the the sex experience, I can translate it into being very hot or gentle? Or in the case of the few scenes? David Susskind Do you have a husband? Samantha Fox No, he's not a husband he's a boyfriend. I have a lover. I've been with the same man for eight years. David Susskind Does he know what you do? Samantha Fox Yes, he was also in the X rated industry. So that's how we met now. I'm out of it. And So is he David Susskind did you make him get out of it? Samantha Fox I did. David Susskind You didn't like what he did for a living. Jack Wrangler I didn't want him to be in doing films and having sex with other people. And me not. David Susskind Why didn't you become a co star a couple Gloria Leonard There are some couples in the business who will not work with anybody else but their partners. David Susskind That's touching. Gloria Leonard It is it certainly limits the number of films you can appear in Jack Wrangler Samantha and I became kind of a couple so that I think so did we because it's I think a lot of the girls become Well, anybody becomes the name of the industry for the same reasons that other actors and legit business do as far as their vulnerability or their a quality about them that is either return on or a warmth or something that makes people want to see Gloria Leonard I'm always thethe gutsy, authoritative woman in charge Marc Stevens The more willing a performer is, the more center stage they get maybe the bigger the salary. I think that's certainly part of it Gloria Leonard And also Thank goodness for the fact that agehas not become a restriction because women might certainly do have sex and I think we're at a time when women over 40 are enjoying the highest profile of any other time. Joan Collins Jane Fonda David Susskind You could have a mad affair with Rasputan. we'll be right back. |
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Cut to Break
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Back in Studio
INTERVIEW CONCLUDES: David Susskind I want to thank my guests you really were very giving and illuminating on the subject pornography and filmmaking. We will be back next week at the same time. |
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Specialty CollectionThis reel is currently not available for online viewing.
Year: 1985
Color: Color
Genre: TV TALK SHOWS
Description: "EVERYTHING YOU EVER WANTED TO KNOW ABOUT PORNO MOVIES" WITH SAMANTHA FOX, CANDIDA ROYALLE, JACK WRANGLER, MARC STEVENS, GLORIA LEONARD (HF-YTV, 2018)
Keywords: interviewer
